Re: your 1/26 comments

I’m not sure why you consider my arguing with my teacher “stupid”. I admitted I basically lost it with him in front of my class. I was only 15 after all. The way I see it, anything you do that leads to wisdom can’t be stupid.

I’m not sure, reading your comments to me and others, where you’re coming from. It’s probably true that most atheists know the Bible better than most Christians. Logically, you have to understand an idea before you can reject it; it’s much easier to never think about it and just pray merrily along.

I think many people have misconceptions about why atheists abandon religion. I didn’t change because I had some kind of agenda. I simply realized I didn’t buy it. That’s it. Angels, demons, waking on water, etc.? Ridiculous ideas. Nonsense. That’s all. I just don’t buy it.

Gary

Of course, if I were talking to Lauren, my writings would be worded much differently, and not sarcastic/etc. I have lots of experience in talking to (reasonable, decent) Christians. I can get them to consider new points in their religion to relate to situations, either as to why the religion is stupid if they are willing to believe this, or to why they should be more happy or take a good action from a standpoint that will appeal to those who would never give up their religion. In other words, I would say all the same things I just said above, but I wouldn’t sound like this.

Then I finally got to retire and had some time on my hands and people I would meet on the street would ask what are you doing these days? And I said nothing, I’m retired and they would say, “That’s nice!” and then they would ask, ‘Which church do I go to?” So I started asking myself, “Why do people care about which church I attend?” And then I ask myself, “How come so many Americans are so acclimated and adamant about religion and beliefs? And then I got to wondering about just how did Christianity and the Bible and religious beliefs get started in America?

I got to thinking to myself, just how did all those idiotic religious beliefs get over here and arrive on to this non-Christian land? It hit me!!! It was a white man named Christopher Columbus, whom brought with him a Bible to protect him and his crew from evil spirits and demons and to save him and his ship from falling off the edge of the earth because it was well known knowledge that anyone leaving the sight of land on a ship was sure disaster and a death sentence for the ship and her crew, because they would be falling off the edge of the flat earth and into hell for eternity.

Then I got to thinking that was around 1492, the year that Columbus discovered America, just 518 years ago, it took 1492 A.D. years before anyone was brave enough to leave the sight of land for fear of falling off the face of the flat earth?

So I got to thinking, “What else did people not know just a few hundred years ago?”

They thought that diseases were caused by demons and evil spirits and witch spells.

We now know with the invention of the microscope and medical discovery, that diseases are caused by bacteria, germs, microbes, and man made chemicals and from the radiation from the Sun.

We now know that rainbows are caused by the Suns reflection of water molecules, and not by a god’s promise to not flood the earth.

We now know that Islands in the pacific and other oceans are caused by millions of years of volcanic action rising out of the seas and growing everyday and not that the earth is just 6 thousand years old.

We now know with the invention of the telescope, that there exists over 125 billion other galaxies similar to our own that most likely hosts life just as this galaxy does.

So with just that little bit of factual knowledge led me to realize that the people who wrote the Bible had very little knowledge of the earth and it’s surroundings and were just guessing about how we all got here and that we each have a specific purpose to serve and worship some imaginary god, otherwise we will be punished according to our works and our own individual beliefs.

What kind of god that can create the whole entire universe in just 6 days would want, need, or desire worship or praise from his own creation?

A weak man made god, that’s the kind of god that would want such nonsense.

If I were a god, my main concern would be to keep the planets and the moons and the solar system in good working order, rather than trying to keep up with what a planet or planets with billions of people on them thinks or believe in their puny little minds.

And so the white man used the Bible to justify the killing and taking the Indians land because they were considered heathen infidels because they did not believe in Jesus.

But the Indians were not heathen infidels, they were “Human Beings” just like the rest of us, doing what regular human beings do.

Claiming to be a Christian is a “Bad Thing”, it’s looked upon as good, but Christianity and it’s past has been swept and clouded under the rug of history.

So then I began thinking of other aspects of Christianity and wondering what else might not be true. Instead of ignoring what atheists had to say, I paid attention, and to my surprise, they made a lot of sense. Biblical stories that I had been taught were literal history turned out to be allegory and myth. Commands that I had been told were the irrefutable word of God turned out to have no relevance in today’s world. Most astounding was the realization that the entire story of Jesus, from his conception to his resurrection, was based on ancient myths going back many thousands of years, all the way to the Egyptians! Eventually, I stopped going to church, praying, and worrying about what God thought. Either there is no God, or he isn’t paying attention to human beings–and a god who doesn’t care looks exactly the same as a god who doesn’t exist.

As for an afterlife–well, if there is one, nobody knows what form it will take. How do we know the Buddhists and Hindus aren’t correct, and you get reincarnated over and over? Whatever happens, nobody seems to have a clue, and that tells me that it’s not that important. Do the best you can to be a good person, take advantage of the opportunities that come your way, and be excellent to other people. Live this life NOW, and whatever happens after you die, will take care of itself. I don’t remember existing before I was born, so it will be no big deal if I don’t exist when I die.

Just remember: it’s a gift. Because before now, as part of the religion, nobody ever encouraged anyone to even think about things like “what is meaning” or “what’s my purpose” that didn’t have a pat answer in the index of a Moody book in the church library. They want you to think that outside of God belief, there are no questions like that, and everybody lives for material possessions and debauchery.

But, HAH! What they don’t tell you is that all these thousands of years while Judaism and Christianity existed, there lived millions and millions of people OUTSIDE of those faiths! Swear to “Bob!” In fact, outside of those faiths there were and are living, breathing thinkers and philosophers and even scientists who had great answers–or even more questions in response to those questions.

There’s this mystical place in the world, far, far east of here, where they never did Jesus, where questions like “without God, isn’t life meaningless?” are seen as Bar jokes. Or met with blank stares. Or answered with paradoxical questions, or challenges. “The answer is ‘to live.’” That seems like a head-scratcher, until you figure out it can be taken seriously.

If there is no God, no heaven or hell, no redemption or damnation, then what happens when I die? Is it just eternal dark nothingness? I have been living in that mentality and it is depressing.

I always thought living ‘forever’ was a depressing thought. Just like it’s described in a Star Trek: Voyager episode. I mean, imagine knowing that you must always be conscious and exist - there’s no way to end it. You can be everything, do everything, observe every atom in the universe… and there’s still time left over.

Creepy.

I have come to the conclusion that rejecting God for me is not an option because, well to be honest I can’t really deal with the idea of rejecting God any better than the idea of believing in God.

Do neither. “Rejecting” God implies that you’re willing yourself to actively do something about God or that you’re making an active judgement on “which team to play for”. Treat God the same way you treat the tooth fairy, leprechauns, gnomes, elves, goblins, and Harry Potter - a book character. The Bible is a collection of allegorical fiction - old fiction, for sure - but still fiction.

Do you really think that all of this is really just for us, and we’re “special considerations” of a creator that is monitoring each and every one of us 24/7? My human ego, pride and hubris wants to say yes, but a simple observation of scale would clearly suggest no.

—

Best of luck to Lauren - she reminds me of myself towards the end of high school. It’s a short jump from “I’m not really digging the Jesus thing” to “Life makes a lot more sense when I’m not trying to shoehorn explanations into things where the explanation clearly doesn’t fit.”

You said all the right things Bob in your response Bob - I have the same viewpoint! Life is short - live it up.